So I've noticed a lot more authors are bailing on fanfiction.net and moving to A03 instead. While I personally get a head spinning headache when navigating A03, everyone keeps telling me how much better it is. Supposedly for those of us who write or want to write more explicit scenes they say A03 is better, even though FF.net doesn't seem to be red flagging stories for too much 'smut' as I've read quite a few that would be MA here on Dokuga. Supposedly there was a huge purge that wiped out a lot of good stores several years back. On top of that, several authors have said that they find the audiences on A03 to be more generous, and receive more reviews than FF.net.

I've requested an invite since supposedly it can take days to months to receive one, but I'm still in reserves about using AO3, there's been so many complaints about their tagging system, and possibility of plagiarism. So what are all your guys views on it, is it worth the try or would I be better of staying with FF.net, while I would never leave Dokuga cause I enjoy and love all my fellow dokugians and all their support for my stories. I need a good place to put all my other non Kag/Sess stories.

Nathaniel z Alexandria wrote:
I think I can answer this one.
So I've been using Ao3 religiously for the past year, although I have had an account for a while. It's fairly difficult to navigate at first but there is a method to the madness and I've found methods to find what want.
People are a lot warmer on Ao3. It's easier to get comments in general and you can answer comments as a writer. It's easy to engage with your audience. There's a space for summarizing each chapter, notes without interfering with your word count and it's easy to edit there. I wrote a Miraculous fic that did amazing there but did not do as well on FF.
Tagging over there is important. There are the major ones like Rape/Noncon, Graphic Depictions of Violence, underage etc that alerts you to themes in the story. The writer could then add more specific tags that you should read in order to not get blind sided. Sometimes tags are crazy and it's just the author's thoughts and are made up.
On Ao3 you can credit your fics with others. As in if you were inspired by one you have the option to click on something and state what it is and it would provide a link.
However, not all fandoms do well there. The Sesskag content is lacking in a way that makes ff better. In general older fandoms aren't too big there especially if you ship certain alternative fics. You'll have to test the water honestly.


So basically for Kagome/Sesshoumaru ficts it's better to rely on FF.net and here on Dokuga of course. I have a new pairing I've decided to try with Usagi/Vegeta, it looks like Dragon Ball Z is a popular one on A03. Yeah i definetely consider the workings of the site to be madness, that'd be great to have a easier way to reply to my readers. Yeah, definetely notices a LOT of tags on the stories i've seen so far. Thanks for the info.

I think I can answer this one.
So I've been using Ao3 religiously for the past year, although I have had an account for a while. It's fairly difficult to navigate at first but there is a method to the madness and I've found methods to find what want.
People are a lot warmer on Ao3. It's easier to get comments in general and you can answer comments as a writer. It's easy to engage with your audience. There's a space for summarizing each chapter, notes without interfering with your word count and it's easy to edit there. I wrote a Miraculous fic that did amazing there but did not do as well on FF.
Tagging over there is important. There are the major ones like Rape/Noncon, Graphic Depictions of Violence, underage etc that alerts you to themes in the story. The writer could then add more specific tags that you should read in order to not get blind sided. Sometimes tags are crazy and it's just the author's thoughts and are made up.
On Ao3 you can credit your fics with others. As in if you were inspired by one you have the option to click on something and state what it is and it would provide a link.
However, not all fandoms do well there. The Sesskag content is lacking in a way that makes ff better. In general older fandoms aren't too big there especially if you ship certain alternative fics. You'll have to test the water honestly.

I'm on AO3 and I think it has several advantages, compared to FF.net.

a) As you said, a few years ago on FF.net, there was a purge of many stories containing explicit sexual content, whereas such content is permitted on AO3, as long as the story is accurately rated/tagged. This happened before I started writing my own stories, and though I once registered on FF.net, I ended up not posting anything there because the story posting interface says up-front that explicit sexual content is not permitted. And that's my favorite content!!


b) AO3 allows for comprehensive tagging, whereas FF.net does not: an author can attach tags for all characters involved in the story, all character relationships, genre elements, and several other things too numerous to list here. Authors can also create custom tags, for further descriptive or comic effect. Then, each tag acts as a link to a custom search, allowing readers to see other stories that have those same tags.

c) On AO3, authors can respond to comments on their stories in the form of comment chains, in the story's comments section. On FF.net, this is not possible, so an author has to respond to a comment in the text of the story itself. This may explain why AO3 readers seem to be more generous with their comments/reviews, since the more flexible commenting system makes it more likely for them to get a direct response from the author.

d) From the reader's perspective, AO3 has features that FF.net doesn't. For example, the chapter index has a full-page view, so for very long stories, this makes the index easier to browse. You can download stories in a variety of formats, including PDF. Also, you can view the entire story at once - a fun side effect of this is that it lets an author see how many times they use different character names, or particular words. For example, in my 'A Twist in the Myth,' I use Naraku's name more than 2,400 times, and the f-word more than 450 times, LOL.

So overall, I think AO3 is worth the wait to get an account, if you want to start posting there.

Dunkelgelb wrote:
I'm on AO3 and I think it has several advantages, compared to FF.net.

a) As you said, a few years ago on FF.net, there was a purge of many stories containing explicit sexual content, whereas such content is permitted on AO3, as long as the story is accurately rated/tagged. This happened before I started writing my own stories, and though I once registered on FF.net, I ended up not posting anything there because the story posting interface says up-front that explicit sexual content is not permitted. And that's my favorite content!!


b) AO3 allows for comprehensive tagging, whereas FF.net does not: an author can attach tags for all characters involved in the story, all character relationships, genre elements, and several other things too numerous to list here. Authors can also create custom tags, for further descriptive or comic effect. Then, each tag acts as a link to a custom search, allowing readers to see other stories that have those same tags.

c) On AO3, authors can respond to comments on their stories in the form of comment chains, in the story's comments section. On FF.net, this is not possible, so an author has to respond to a comment in the text of the story itself. This may explain why AO3 readers seem to be more generous with their comments/reviews, since the more flexible commenting system makes it more likely for them to get a direct response from the author.

d) From the reader's perspective, AO3 has features that FF.net doesn't. For example, the chapter index has a full-page view, so for very long stories, this makes the index easier to browse. You can download stories in a variety of formats, including PDF. Also, you can view the entire story at once - a fun side effect of this is that it lets an author see how many times they use different character names, or particular words. For example, in my 'A Twist in the Myth,' I use Naraku's name more than 2,400 times, and the f-word more than 450 times, LOL.

So overall, I think AO3 is worth the wait to get an account, if you want to start posting there.

I've read some reviews about the FF.net itself, some people noted that there has been quite a bit of lenacy on some of the content. I've noticed quite a few stories there that would be MA on here. I've posted the same versions of my Kag/Sess stories on there as they are on here, and so far it seems I haven't wandered into the too-explicit territory since I haven't had any alerts to my FF ones. But I do wish to try to extend that territory a bit, thankfully we can post those here but it would be nice to have another place where I could gain more readers. I used to use medaminer but that sites officially obsolete now since it no longer is being managed from what I could tell.

It would be nice to download in variety formats since my chromebook only allows me to view certain file types. lol I've had quite a few times i wanted to use the f-word multiple times but held back cause I didn't want to push my luck with FF. While the sex scenes may not be TOO graphic, at least in my opinion they aren't, since I haven't even written close to what I've seen on here or adult-fanficton.org .

I definitely see myself having to get used to the tagging system, I don't want to throw a million tags on them like many authors on there have done. It's definitely annoying on FF not allowing us more then two chosen characters, since I want to do some *Cough* three way pairing *Cough* lol.

Thanks for all the info. It's leaning me more to giving it a shot and see how well it goes.

I'm one of the writers who's moving out of FFnet.

One of my big issues with FFnet hasn't yet been mentioned in the discussion here and that is the fact that FFnet is a commercial site. They're running ads, which are very annoying. And even if I use an adblock, I know they are there and that they're essentially making profit off of us.
AO3 is run by a nonprofit organisation that consists of fans themselves, much like Dokuga but on a larger scale. FFnet is there to make money, while AO3 is there to help and protect fans and fandom.

The big purge as mentioned, afaik, followed a sale of FFnet to a new corporation and they wanted to "clean" the place up. Because FFnet is for profit, I feel like I can't trust them as much. When are they going to issue some other policy change? Or once again start enforcing the rules they've largely been ignoring and start to delete stories without warning again?
AO3 does not regulate the content posted there in the same way. MA stories are fine, as long as you tag properly.

Another big thing for me is the posting system. I write a lot of one shots these days, so I'm more often posting a wholly new story instead of just posting an update to a chapter fic. And the posting system on FFnet is outdated and needlessly clunky and just thinking about having to update something on FFnet exhausts me.
The posting system on AO3 is so much nicer. You can access it straight from your dashboard and you can upload the story and fill in the info all in one place instead of having to click to agree to rules and post a document and only then actually upload the story like on FFnet.


Also AO3 has a number of features that FFnet does not have, from a writer's perspective as well.

I've shared a fic that I did in a video format on AO3, because I could embed the link to a youtube video there. Or a social media AU fic with mock twitter screenshots as part of the story, because on AO3 I could upload images into the story.
You can add a co-writer to a fic. You can gift a fic to someone.
I can easily with just one click on my dashboard, view all the fics I've posted in a particular fandom. And when you're in this fandom view or viewing all your works, the same filters you can use to search fics are also in place in the sidebar so if you're looking for a particular fic of yours you don't need to wade through pages of posted fic but can filter them via completion status, tags, ratings, word count...
You can use the series function for example to lump together multiple one shots you've posted separately but are set in the same universe.
You can use HTML coding in author's notes so if you write a sequel for example or someone gifts art for your fic, you can link it in an AN.

Those are just some examples.

This is stupid long and probably unnecessary so i'm sorry in advance.

Uhm, so, there have been a lot of things already said, but I supposed I could give my own opinion in case it might interest you. (I honestly feel Dunkelgelb did a much more succinct job of addressing good differences, mine is more opinion based ^^;)


Concerning the MA content, to be honest, whether it’s leniency or just not bothering to really moderate in the first place, I prefer not to risk posting something that could lead to having my fic or even account removed. So if you’re wanting to do more MA stuff, I’d certainly recommended not even dealing with possible outcomes with FF, especially if just levels of strong language and mild sexual content has you hesitant with them. If you wanna get truly explicit and/or hardcore, ao3 is definitely the place I’d recommend (of course Dokuga for sesskag works too, obviously, so long as properly rated!). I have stuff/have read stuff on ao3 (for my other fandom mostly, but anyway) that I cannot imagine ever being on FF. Ever. Like I bet it would get snipped while just being in text boxes on there.

While I do have an FF.net account and still post my (‘allowable’) sesskag there just as I have for a long time now, and I do have readers there, I personally have barely ever read things on FF. And whenever I did, it was many years ago and so rare I have almost no memory of doing so. The idea of doing it now does not interest me, especially after so much time on ao3 the last few years. As a reader, I find ao3 significantly more palatable to the eye. And one reason I do is something I appreciate both as a reader and a writer, and that is it’s nicely segregated. Your content is separate from your Author’s Notes sections – should you wish to use them, and the break of the content info at the top is more obvious, arranged, and easier to read. I really like that neater look.

As a writer I find the inputs for your content on ao3 when posting much nicer. It’s easier to go in and edit things, and while there is more to fill out, yes, I appreciate that aspect both as a writer and especially as a reader. You can barely tag your content on FF.net; and really I wouldn’t even say ‘tagging’ is the right word for it since you can barely select choices for your fic’s content. I personally quite like the tagging system on ao3 (though some people definitely do over-tag; not just necessarily having a lot, cause sometimes there can be a lot to tag, but tagging things unnecessarily because of other tag selections you already have). I find the tags as helpful, if not more, than just the summary for a fic as that doesn’t always tell me if I’ll want to invest my time in that fic. Of course everyone has their own way of tagging, some do very general things, some put in more little tidbits than just a singular more specific tag. I like those better, not just because they can give more input into the fic’s content, but I also gives a greater impression of an actual person being behind the fic (I know obviously there always is, but things seem more personable overall with a lot of the interaction possibilities; the tagging, the author’s notes, the comments).

The fact you can actually see the comments and your responses, and can edit and delete them, also helps with that personable feel. You can interact with your readers or with a writer whose fic you enjoyed and want to show your appreciation, or even the other commenters too. I actually made two friends in my other fandom through interacting with the comments on my and one of one of their fics! Also you can chose to moderate the comments your fic receives if you’d like, and only things you approve appear. I think you can even turn them off entirely now? not sure about that though.

In your author’s notes sections you can link to things – like other places that fic is located, maybe other accounts of yours where people can find and further interact with you and your fics, etc. You can gift fics, credit fics, sign up for challenges, time the release of your fics/chapters, you can submit fics to collections or have people request to put one of your fics in a collection of theirs. You can collab post fics so it shows both the people involved in the author area. As already mentioned, you can download fics, which is nice for wanting to save favorites so you don’t lose them!

It’s true that of course some fandoms are bigger and/or do better on ao3 than others, and a lot of that has to do with the age of the fandom. FF will of course have more sesskag, for example, because it’s older and when newer FF was the place many went to post. I have seen sesskag fics get decent and pretty nice view counts on ao3, and really, if we want to have more there we have to actually post content for it there. Both for readers to find and thus continue coming back to search for more, and as writers to have more people come to read and give more incentive to post there.

A last thing, and this might not be something everyone’s dealt with to great extents, but FF has ads. They were always a tad annoying, but recently (or it’s recent to me because I hadn’t noticed for a while perhaps) they are so much worse. I have had ones that just take me to a whole page ad – though I can thankfully X out of it and it takes me back to where I was, but ugh. And then I discovered there are ads IN the fics themselves. Big fat ads, some of which are VIDEOS.



This is more than half of one chapter of a sesskag fic of mine on FF. I zoomed out as much as possible just to be able to fit all five of those monstrosities in one image screenshot. That’s absolutely ridiculous to me. There are two of those things with a SINGLE LINE of text between it. And this is the second chapter; the first had nothing, but the second? Five. FIVE. WITH VIDEO. It’s like a trick on the unsuspecting reader. I’ll still post there whenever I have applicable sesskag content - though i've been leaning a lot into probably only for my collection of oneshots -, again, for the readers I know I have there, and as a reader myself I know how much I appreciate fics being there for me rather than just disappearing. (though the responses/interaction I get on ao3 I feel is far better in comparison; admittedly I’m using my experience with my other fandom’s fics there as I’ve only posted one sesskag on ao3 thus far, but still) But if I ever was going to consider reading there again, I definitely wouldn’t.


Okaaaaaay… that was way too much rambling and you’ve likely already made your decision anyway. Again this is much more of a personal opinion than a general comparison or giving info on ao3 – which others have already done, and better than I did XP if this does help at all, then glad to have helped! If it just made your eyes bleed, well, I have that effect sometimes with my rambling post tendencies. I’m not good at short and concise…

No problem for the long reply, Itsumademo


I've been keeping most of my MA works as 'clean' as I can so as not to tread into the too explicit territory. So being able to extend that territory for my at least my Dokuga and A03 versions would be nice.

To be able to moderate my reviews would be nice, I have been on the receiving end of quite a few flames on FF.net because someone just didn't like the way my story was headed or for example, Kagome and Ayame's cravings in my Jaken's Nightmare story. I got chewed out because the reviewer believed there they couldn't have those kind of cravings and that it wasn't possible to have cravings like the ones I used.


I also noticed the extra ads that keep popping up while trying to read a fanfict. There are still several on FF.net that I love reading so I've been putting up with it even though it's quite annoying. I think in just a one-shot Kagome/Hiei one I found like 10 ads in-between all the paragraphs.

Thankes Chie, Yeah the ads have definitely been extremely noticeable. I also hate the whole having to go into Doc Manager then going to story manager, ect. and the blah blah extra steps that FF.net seems to enjoy making us go through before we can post. I appreciate all the input from everyone it's made A03 look a lot better than my original views on it.

Siera Serenity Star wrote:
No problem for the long reply, Itsumademo


I've been keeping most of my MA works as 'clean' as I can so as not to tread into the too explicit territory. So being able to extend that territory for my at least my Dokuga and A03 versions would be nice.

To be able to moderate my reviews would be nice, I have been on the receiving end of quite a few flames on FF.net because someone just didn't like the way my story was headed or for example, Kagome and Ayame's cravings in my Jaken's Nightmare story. I got chewed out because the reviewer believed there they couldn't have those kind of cravings and that it wasn't possible to have cravings like the ones I used.


I also noticed the extra ads that keep popping up while trying to read a fanfict. There are still several on FF.net that I love reading so I've been putting up with it even though it's quite annoying. I think in just a one-shot Kagome/Hiei one I found like 10 ads in-between all the paragraphs.

glad you survived my post and found it somewhat helpful ^-^

you can also just delete comments from your fic if you don't want to deal with moderating each comment :3 i've been lucky to not have rude comments on my writing thus far in life, but i have friends who've suffered, and i get that having them always there staring at you isn't pleasant. hopefully you'll have better luck!

yikes. 10 ads is..blegh. since i never read much on FF i don't have favs that are purely there, but i know if i did i would probably do the same as you and suffer for my beloved fics.